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    Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

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    ziggy

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    Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by ziggy on Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:09 pm

    This is just a weird thing to do after you've allegedly killed four people in a messy way and their bodies are still in the house. It's just one of the many odd things in this case.


    According to the timeline, this is after Mel's dad came looking for her, after The Pastor Mr. N is killed, after he calls his family with the strange "I love yous", after the police do a welfare check. In fact, it is one hour after the cop was at the house inquiring about Mel's whereabouts and Sam tells him they should be back from the movies around 1 a.m. - well it was about 1 a.m. when he called the police claiming he heard noises in the basement.

    Now one theory from the Farmville grapevine by way of our local Peacegurl is that the welfare check was done by a single cop - (for those of you catching up, he is tall and skinny and not youthful and we've been calling him skinny cop) and that - AND THIS IS LOCAL RUMOR ONLY - when Sam called about things going bump in the night, he asked for the same skinny cop, but that cop was out on another call and they sent two officers instead. It was told through the Farmville vine that skinny cop himself believed that he had dodged a bullet; he felt Sam called and asked for him basically targeting him as a next victim.

    So, did Sam really get scared and hear noises? Was he on a killing spree and decided that after the ladies and a pastor he should target skinny cop? Was it a lame attempt to set up an intruder story - the intruder who came back and killed everyone except Sam after the women came back from the movies? Did he want to get caught?
    I'm just trying to figure out why he would call the police and let them in the house with 3 decaying bodies and one recently murdered, a den full of evidence - maybe even blood in the kitchen, who knows, and Mel's parents hot on their daughter's trail - it was risky don't you think?

    I somehow lean toward targeting skinny cop as a next victim. He'd already called and said his good-byes kind of, to his family and I ponder that he may have wanted to really be infamous and go for the cop. After all, his horrocore homies tend to worship mass murderers.

    Your theories?
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    dangrsmind

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by dangrsmind on Sat Feb 20, 2010 7:05 pm

    Pazuzu was down there.
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    wadahoot

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by wadahoot on Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:33 am

    hoping for suicide-by-cop?
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    AndresEscobar

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:56 pm

    Maybe he was acting erratically because he just killed four people.
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    dangrsmind

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by dangrsmind on Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:31 pm

    Seriously, I tend to think he was just living out a horror movie cliche.
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    tapu

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by tapu on Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:12 pm

    I'm sticking with my most recently vetted opinion of his being a psychopath who killed to match what he worshipped in horror. So, cop was next. Girls, mom, dad/PRIEST, cop.
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    dangrsmind

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by dangrsmind on Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:47 pm

    tapu wrote:I'm sticking with my most recently vetted opinion of his being a psychopath who killed to match what he worshipped in horror. So, cop was next. Girls, mom, dad/PRIEST, cop.

    But what about the Indian chief?

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    tapu

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by tapu on Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:00 pm

    Y-M-C-A It's fun to go to the YMCA!


    Indian chief.... Hmm... well, I don't know that much about Virginia. Any sports teams there called the Indians? hyuk, hyuk
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    AndresEscobar

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:58 pm

    dangrsmind wrote:
    tapu wrote:I'm sticking with my most recently vetted opinion of his being a psychopath who killed to match what he worshipped in horror. So, cop was next. Girls, mom, dad/PRIEST, cop.

    But what about the Indian chief?




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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Guest on Sun Feb 21, 2010 9:06 pm

    We had the Richmond Braves......Baseball team
    They moved down south last year.
    Now we have the Richmond Squirrels.
    Go Figure
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    Percy
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Percy on Sun Feb 21, 2010 9:20 pm

    This is the one aspect of this case that I still cant make any sense of. On the surface it seems he was trying to perhaps set up an alibi but the fact that there is a local rumor going around that he specifically asked for our friend "skinny cop" it does make me wonder if he wasnt done killing and wanted to go out with one last bang.

    I dont see suicide cop here, if that were the case having 2 cops show up would be better for that, trying to take one out while the other fills you full of lead, but the fact that he only asked for one means he may have been laying in wait for him to show up and would have jumped him the second he walked through the door. I hate to think of Sam as such a cold blooded killer because all along as you know I have tried to make sense of this in such a way that he simply he lost it because of Emma's possible rejection of him and the Pastor's murder was simply the result of trying to avoid detection until he could get out of there. But now that I ponder this further, if the local rumor is true that he specificaly requested the one skinny cop then he may indeed had plans to kill him and that would make him nothing but the cold blooded killer than many believe he is.

    Hopefully at some point we will hear from Sam himself and he will explain his reasoning behind this but I suspect we may never have an answer to this question.

    It is a good question nonetheless and one of the more interesting parts of this case which as we all know has many, many interesting parts.


    Where is my buddy Andres, I miss hearing from you brother. Dont be shy. We need your input around here. I have been busy trying to keep the other part of the forum interesting but I plan to now get back over here and start discussing our case once again which is the whole purpose of being here to begin with.


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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Guest on Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:32 pm

    it all seems weird. if the 'skinny cop' rumor is true, then his plan to kill turned into premeditated? also, since that plan--if its true---that plan killed over,,,,then he gets in the car and drives down a road for whatever his plan might have been,,, to get stopped and pulled over,,,that plan got squashed,,, makes you wonder if he gave up and then tried to head back home, no matter what was said by his father to not go back home. do we know he had planned to go back home then? then strike 3, you're out and he is arrested! someone made the comment that it is like a cliche of a horror movie, it's all so weird, like it is living a horror movie,,,perhaps that is what he wanted,,,
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:40 pm

    Maybe Sam was going to turn himself in and he chickened out. Maybe instead of saying to the police dispatcher: "Hey, can you send the lone skinny cop back out here please I, ahem, think I hear something?" he said something to the effect of "Can you send that officer that was just out here back?"

    king :drunken: cat
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    ziggy

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by ziggy on Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:19 am

    Hmm, never thought of that ...perhaps. I don't know LE procedures that well, but wouldn't dispatch ask what for? So you think the noise in the basement may have been an afterthought but the original call was just to ask the cop to come back so he could confess and then when asked why he made up the basement story, was surprised to see two cops, changed his mind about confessing and had to go through with letting them see the basement?
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    AndresEscobar

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:41 am

    ziggy wrote:Hmm, never thought of that ...perhaps. I don't know LE procedures that well, but wouldn't dispatch ask what for? So you think the noise in the basement may have been an afterthought but the original call was just to ask the cop to come back so he could confess and then when asked why he made up the basement story, was surprised to see two cops, changed his mind about confessing and had to go through with letting them see the basement?

    No, i think he used the noises in the basement in both cases. Perhaps that wasn't clear in my original statement. I was trying to show how someone could ask for the same police office to come back without it seemingly being as incriminating.
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    TiffaniLane

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by TiffaniLane on Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:49 am

    AndresEscobar wrote:Maybe Sam was going to turn himself in and he chickened out. Maybe instead of saying to the police dispatcher: "Hey, can you send the lone skinny cop back out here please I, ahem, think I hear something?" he said something to the effect of "Can you send that officer that was just out here back?"

    king :drunken: cat

    The one thing I keep thinking is it was SO SO soon after the first check (on Mel) that he called back. Maybe when the officer originally came to check on Mel, it really hit him that someone sooner rather than later is gonna be demanding answers. So i'm leaning a little toward maybe going to turn himself in? or, man I don't know, maybe it was him thinking well, i'll call a cop to the basement and if they catch a smell of the body's and i'm discovered then i'll be caught and it's how its supposed to be. Did we ever find out if when sam called this person to confess, was he upset? was he ok? was he bragging? do we know his mindset then? I'm just not feeling the whole call the specific cop back out to murder him. I just don't see it, although it is possible...
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Percy on Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:04 pm

    TiffaniLane wrote:
    AndresEscobar wrote:Maybe Sam was going to turn himself in and he chickened out. Maybe instead of saying to the police dispatcher: "Hey, can you send the lone skinny cop back out here please I, ahem, think I hear something?" he said something to the effect of "Can you send that officer that was just out here back?"

    king :drunken: cat

    The one thing I keep thinking is it was SO SO soon after the first check (on Mel) that he called back. Maybe when the officer originally came to check on Mel, it really hit him that someone sooner rather than later is gonna be demanding answers. So i'm leaning a little toward maybe going to turn himself in? or, man I don't know, maybe it was him thinking well, i'll call a cop to the basement and if they catch a smell of the body's and i'm discovered then i'll be caught and it's how its supposed to be. Did we ever find out if when sam called this person to confess, was he upset? was he ok? was he bragging? do we know his mindset then? I'm just not feeling the whole call the specific cop back out to murder him. I just don't see it, although it is possible...

    According to what I have read re: comments from the person Sam called from the horrorcore crowd of his (that person then calling Shrim from SKR who then called the LE) Sam simply said to him "I killed them all", this person commented that Sam was very upset and didnt know what to do, the person then says he told Sam to turn himself in. I believe that is the extent of what we know about that conversation.


    Also I dont remember who you are, are you from the couch or WS, you seem to know the case well! Glad youre here in any case and welcome to the forum.


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    AndresEscobar

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:09 pm

    TiffaniLane wrote:

    The one thing I keep thinking is it was SO SO soon after the first check (on Mel) that he called back. Maybe when the officer originally came to check on Mel, it really hit him that someone sooner rather than later is gonna be demanding answers. So i'm leaning a little toward maybe going to turn himself in? or, man I don't know, maybe it was him thinking well, i'll call a cop to the basement and if they catch a smell of the body's and i'm discovered then i'll be caught and it's how its supposed to be. Did we ever find out if when sam called this person to confess, was he upset? was he ok? was he bragging? do we know his mindset then? I'm just not feeling the whole call the specific cop back out to murder him. I just don't see it, although it is possible...

    I think it's possible -- even probable -- that the lone, skinny cop THINKS that Sam wanted to kill him. When people are close to tragic, horrific events like this, people always tend to think that they might have been next. Just because the lone, skinny cop thinks this doesn't mean it was what Sam wanted to do.

    However, if Sam did indeed want to kill a cop, I don't see why the difference between one cop or two cops stopped him. If he killed the lone, skinny cop he would have been in custody and/or dead within 20-30 minutes anyway. Maybe an hour if he made a run for it in the cop car. Cops are in constant radio contact with dispatchers.

    Or, why if he were so blood thirsty he didn't kill a neighbor or one of the college kids or the animals or a jogger or a pizza man, etc.
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Percy on Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:29 pm

    That actually occured to me last night, Andres, if he really was that bloodthirsty he could have easily led a neighbor in to the house to do what it is he needed to do. Also, the whole lone skinny cop thing is a local rumor that smells more like the beginnings of a legend than anything else. We dont even know if any of that is true. At this point I am still unwilling to think Sam is a crazed bloodthristy
    psychopathic killer without more evidence pointing in that direction. All I see right now with the facts we have at our disposal is likely a loner kid who reacted in a fucking horrifying and unimaginable way to a girl's rejection of him.

    I am going with a very lame attempt to set up an "intruder did it" defense.


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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by TiffaniLane on Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:14 pm

    Thanks Pax! its angels_not_forgotten from WS.

    And I'm going to agree with you Andres, i'll never say someone wasn't feeling what they feel, If that made any sense lol, i'm sure even coming to contact with someone who did such horrible acts that lay undiscovered feet away...i can imagine it has been a terrible shock to him Sad

    I guess the reason I don't see it is this. Ok, what was sam going to do, kill skinny cop and run and no one would ever know it was him? why would he care if there were two cops? I mean if we truly believe sam is not crazy and did these things in cold blood, what is one more body to his already high count?

    I can see the "intruder did it" approach, I mean, if he can make it to the airport (bringing in the other theory that was where he was going in the car, to sleep, watch movies, hit the airport and be ghost...but to where? not back home right?? sorry tangent!) he can say I thought I heard something! me and her have had a fight and I left, went to get some food, just walked around for the night and came home. I called a cop to check a noise, it wasn't me!" But you would also assume that the TOD would really muff that up.

    I honestly don't think he had any one plan in mind at any point in time and committed the acts in a precise manor. I think he was a very scared person that did an act he couldn't take back...and now he's been caught.
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Percy on Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:32 pm

    TiffaniLane wrote:Thanks Pax! its angels_not_forgotten from WS.

    And I'm going to agree with you Andres, i'll never say someone wasn't feeling what they feel, If that made any sense lol, i'm sure even coming to contact with someone who did such horrible acts that lay undiscovered feet away...i can imagine it has been a terrible shock to him Sad

    I guess the reason I don't see it is this. Ok, what was sam going to do, kill skinny cop and run and no one would ever know it was him? why would he care if there were two cops? I mean if we truly believe sam is not crazy and did these things in cold blood, what is one more body to his already high count?

    I can see the "intruder did it" approach, I mean, if he can make it to the airport (bringing in the other theory that was where he was going in the car, to sleep, watch movies, hit the airport and be ghost...but to where? not back home right?? sorry tangent!) he can say I thought I heard something! me and her have had a fight and I left, went to get some food, just walked around for the night and came home. I called a cop to check a noise, it wasn't me!" But you would also assume that the TOD would really muff that up.

    I honestly don't think he had any one plan in mind at any point in time and committed the acts in a precise manor. I think he was a very scared person that did an act he couldn't take back...and now he's been caught.


    Hugs for Tiff, I am so glad you made it, I had tried to PM you when all this went down and we ended up going from one place to another and I started to feel like an ass running everyone in circles and I gave up, so I am really glad you made it as I and I am sure everyone else appreciates your input!


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    dangrsmind

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by dangrsmind on Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:51 pm

    AndresEscobar wrote:Maybe Sam was going to turn himself in and he chickened out. Maybe instead of saying to the police dispatcher: "Hey, can you send the lone skinny cop back out here please I, ahem, think I hear something?" he said something to the effect of "Can you send that officer that was just out here back?"

    king :drunken: cat

    This makes sense to me. Perhaps he wanted to turn himself in, then chickened out and made up the story about th esound inthe basement knowing of course that the animals were down there.
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by Percy on Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:57 pm

    dangrsmind wrote:
    AndresEscobar wrote:Maybe Sam was going to turn himself in and he chickened out. Maybe instead of saying to the police dispatcher: "Hey, can you send the lone skinny cop back out here please I, ahem, think I hear something?" he said something to the effect of "Can you send that officer that was just out here back?"

    king :drunken: cat

    This makes sense to me. Perhaps he wanted to turn himself in, then chickened out and made up the story about th esound inthe basement knowing of course that the animals were down there.
    But he would have had to tell the dispatch why he wanted the cop to come, they need a reason always. So he would have had to have had the noise in the basement story already made up at the time he called the dispatch back I would assume. I dont think they would just accept "Hey can you send that officer back." They would want to know why.


    I can see where he may have wanted to turn himself in to familiar face, perhaps him and lone skinny cop had some nice words the first time he was there and Sam felt comfortable with him but I am still leaning towards a very lame stab, excuse the pun, at trying to set up an intruder did it defense.


    Last edited by Paximus on Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:59 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    AndresEscobar

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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by AndresEscobar on Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:56 pm

    But he would have had to tell the dispatch why he wanted the cop to come, they need a reason always. So he would have had to have had the noise in the basement story already made up at the time he called the dispatch back I would assume. I dont think they would just accept "Hey can you send that officer back." They would want to know why.


    I can see where he may have wanted to turn himself in to familiar face, perhaps him and lone skinny cop had some nice words the first time he was there and Sam felt comfortable with him but I am still leaning towards a very lame stab, excuse the pun, at trying to set up an intruder did it defense.

    Sure. He could have told the dispatcher that thinking maybe he'd turn himself in to the familiar face of the lone skinny cop. When he didn't show up, he just went with his original story.
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    Re: Why did Sam call the police to check the basement?

    Post by charliechan on Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:03 pm

    Sam ended up sitting in that airport. That's something only a child would do. I talked with Andre about this way back when. I spoke out about Sam needing to clean up his appearance. He pointed out that it wasn't necessarily bad for Sam. I'm beginning to beleive that they're gonna go with a "lost little boy" defence.

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